You've been a member of the House of Lords for over 30 years. What are the greatest changes/transitions have you witnessed?I've been a member of the Lords since 1971, but I was a member of the Commons from 1962 to 1970. The composition of the Lords there has changed a lot, with more women and members of ethnic minorities. Since most of the hereditaries were evicted in 1999, there are rules for the number of representatives of the parties and of cross-benchers, which mean that the Government can always be defeated when the opposition combines. There are more Select Committees; the average attendance has improved; there are so called 'family friendly' hours which mean that all-night sittings are a thing of the past.
What are your view on the proposed stage 2 reforms? Do you think they will ever go ahead?
It would be rash to say 'never', but I would be very surprised if they materialise in the near future. As the general election approaches, the Government aren't going to waste time on a matter that isn't any good at all electorally, and could be contentious. Harold Wilson thought he had cross-party agreement to reforms in 1968, but gave up after 21 sitting days of abortive discussion on the floor of the Commons.
It would be rash to say 'never', but I would be very surprised if they materialise in the near future. As the general election approaches, the Government aren't going to waste time on a matter that isn't any good at all electorally, and could be contentious. Harold Wilson thought he had cross-party agreement to reforms in 1968, but gave up after 21 sitting days of abortive discussion on the floor of the Commons.
Are you in favour of a directly elected second chamber?
I'm not keen on a wholly elected second chamber, because there's a strong case for having the expertise of people who aren't connected with political parties such as the President of the Royal Society or the former Chief Inspector of Prisons. On the other hand, if the only alternative on offer is an 80% elected chamber of 450 members, with bishops retained in proportion, I would have to plump for the 100% solution, seeing no reason why the Church of England should have any special treatment.
I'm not keen on a wholly elected second chamber, because there's a strong case for having the expertise of people who aren't connected with political parties such as the President of the Royal Society or the former Chief Inspector of Prisons. On the other hand, if the only alternative on offer is an 80% elected chamber of 450 members, with bishops retained in proportion, I would have to plump for the 100% solution, seeing no reason why the Church of England should have any special treatment.
You were liberal chief whip - a great honour. What was the most challenging aspect of the role?
Generally, being Whip of a small and cohesive party wasn't difficult, but when any Member defied the Party, there were no effective sancttons. When Roddy Bowen accepted the Deputy Speakership in 1964, for instance, effectively depriving the Parliamentary Party of a twelfth of its force, there was nothing Jo Grimond or I could do to stop him. The most troublesome Member in the 1968-70 Parliament was Peter Bessell, who made a habit of coming to my office shortly before a division to say that his conscience was stopping him voting with the Party – even though he had said nothing at the Party meeting a day before.
Generally, being Whip of a small and cohesive party wasn't difficult, but when any Member defied the Party, there were no effective sancttons. When Roddy Bowen accepted the Deputy Speakership in 1964, for instance, effectively depriving the Parliamentary Party of a twelfth of its force, there was nothing Jo Grimond or I could do to stop him. The most troublesome Member in the 1968-70 Parliament was Peter Bessell, who made a habit of coming to my office shortly before a division to say that his conscience was stopping him voting with the Party – even though he had said nothing at the Party meeting a day before.
You voted strongly against the introduction of ID cards, what other bills have you strongly opposed/been in favour of?
I was against ID cards, but I fear it's a losing battle. The Tories wouldn't join us in voting against the introduction of ID cards for immigrants, and that was the thin end of the wedge. And now, with the increasing threat of terrorism and identity theft, I think the general public won't support last ditch attempts to stop the progressive roll-out of ID cards to the rest of the population.
I am strongly against legislation that increases the prison population, and badly thought out measures on immigration. I'm in favour of Bills to ensure that adequate accommodation is made available for Gypsies and Travellers, and I want to see the Government adopting a real strategy to curb the harmful effects of alcohol.
I was against ID cards, but I fear it's a losing battle. The Tories wouldn't join us in voting against the introduction of ID cards for immigrants, and that was the thin end of the wedge. And now, with the increasing threat of terrorism and identity theft, I think the general public won't support last ditch attempts to stop the progressive roll-out of ID cards to the rest of the population.
I am strongly against legislation that increases the prison population, and badly thought out measures on immigration. I'm in favour of Bills to ensure that adequate accommodation is made available for Gypsies and Travellers, and I want to see the Government adopting a real strategy to curb the harmful effects of alcohol.
Despite your allegiance to the liberal democrats - you rebelled against your party's view on the hunting bill. Is this common in the chamber?
I very rarely feel it necessary to vote or speak against the Party line, and that applies to most Members in all three Parties. The only consistent rebels in the Tory and Labour ranks have been the anti-Europeans.
I very rarely feel it necessary to vote or speak against the Party line, and that applies to most Members in all three Parties. The only consistent rebels in the Tory and Labour ranks have been the anti-Europeans.
Describe an average day in the Lords.
Normally, I do paperwork in my office at home in the morning, arriving at the House in time for the start of business. Two days from last week:
Tuesday, President Khama's meeting in the Grand Committee Room. I told him that his father Seretse Khama and I were freshmen together at Balliol in 1945. Then, initiated a motion to disapprove the Immigration Rules changes. Support for postponing the changes from all sides of the House, but the Tories wouldn't vote with us, though David Cameron had an identical motion, not debated, in the Commons.
Normally, I do paperwork in my office at home in the morning, arriving at the House in time for the start of business. Two days from last week:
Tuesday, President Khama's meeting in the Grand Committee Room. I told him that his father Seretse Khama and I were freshmen together at Balliol in 1945. Then, initiated a motion to disapprove the Immigration Rules changes. Support for postponing the changes from all sides of the House, but the Tories wouldn't vote with us, though David Cameron had an identical motion, not debated, in the Commons.
As a result, the changes come into effect tomorrow, halting research programmes in the universities and PCTs.Wednesday, a presentation by the General Teaching Council to the All-Party Parliamentary Group on Gypsies and Travellers in the morning and in the afternoon, fielded a Queston on the processing of visa applications from Sri Lanka and the Maldives, then spoke in the debate on the situation in the Democratic Republic of Congo. The session was prorogued at 20.00, giving us a few days off until the new session begins on December 3.
But what may not always be realised is the volume of work outside the chamber. In the last two weeks, for instance, I have had meetings with a prominent member of the Democrats about the US Presidential campaign; the directors of a wine distributors about loss-leading sales of wine by supermarkets; the Eritrean Ambassador about the situation in the Horn of Africe; a Bangladeshi TV presenter about the forthcoming elections there; with two experts on Somaliland, and with two leaders of the United Resistance Front of Darfur.
But what may not always be realised is the volume of work outside the chamber. In the last two weeks, for instance, I have had meetings with a prominent member of the Democrats about the US Presidential campaign; the directors of a wine distributors about loss-leading sales of wine by supermarkets; the Eritrean Ambassador about the situation in the Horn of Africe; a Bangladeshi TV presenter about the forthcoming elections there; with two experts on Somaliland, and with two leaders of the United Resistance Front of Darfur.
Outside meetings in the same two weeks: the Irish Travellers Movement; 15th anniversary dinner of the Kurdish Human Rights Project (KHRP) (of which I'm President); KHRP book launch the following evening; all day Saturday AGM of the Peru Support Group (of which I'm also President), and an all-day meeting in Oxford of an educational trust of which I'm chairman.
You're a greatly respected Lord and politician, with an excellent record in human rights efforts. What has been your greatest achievement politically?
I think its very seldom justified for an individual to claim credit for political changes, whether in human rights or any other endeavour. Changes happen when there is a minimum critical mass of support for them, and one person can only say that he was active in pursuit of a particular goal.
I think its very seldom justified for an individual to claim credit for political changes, whether in human rights or any other endeavour. Changes happen when there is a minimum critical mass of support for them, and one person can only say that he was active in pursuit of a particular goal.
For many years, for example, I was Chairman of the Eritrea Support Group, which campaigned for the self-determination of the people of Eritrea. When they finally won their independence it was largely through military victory and a referendum, and the contribution made by anybody in the international community was only one of moral support.
I founded the Parliamentary Human Rights Group, chaired it from 1976 to 1997, and continue as vice-chair. I do take pride in the fact that the Group is more effective than ever today in raising the profile of human rights, under the able leadership of Ann Clwyd MP.
I founded the Parliamentary Human Rights Group, chaired it from 1976 to 1997, and continue as vice-chair. I do take pride in the fact that the Group is more effective than ever today in raising the profile of human rights, under the able leadership of Ann Clwyd MP.



Paris may be better known as the city of romance but every year thousands of the industry’s movers and shakers descend upon the French capital for a different reason – The Cartes and Identification show. This year the international trade show, now in it’s 23rd year, focuses upon Contact less payment, convergence, data and transaction security, sustainable development, and of course NFC. With Barack Obama’s appointment to the White House the talk of the town, it seemed fitting that the United States were the 2008 guests of honour. The USA is particularly advanced in their deployment of applications such as electronic documents and payment cards. Having understood the potential of smartcards in the field of security and access control, the United States were the first in the world to have adopted contact less payment using a chip capable of emulating the magnetic strip of their traditional bank cards. The Americans certainly put their mark on the 2008 show, with over fifty exhibitors including the likes of Smartcard Alliance, Sagem, Verifone, Hypercom, and ABnote making the trip across the pond.
Introduction 